Pope thinks that, Dawkins claimed

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Amazing video: bald eagle acts like a duckLast Thursday Richard Dawkins had a debate/conversation with Rowan Williams, the canada goose stockists uk Archbishop of Canterbury, in the Sheldonian Theater at Oxford. The topic: nature of human beings and the question of their ultimate origin. I must confess that I haven yet seen the conversation, which I present in its entirety in the video here, but readers who have seen it should weigh in below.

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cheap canada goose uk Yesterday, the university hosted what seemed tantalisingly like a similar clash of great minds, between the Archbishop of Canterbury, Rowan Williams, and Professor Richard Dawkins like Huxley, a bulldog on behalf of Darwin theories. But anyone hoping for a dust up canada goose outlet toronto address would have been sorely disappointed, canada goose outlet eu for the conversation was conducted with utmost politeness. The cleric even confessed his belief in evolution, and agreed with Dawkins that humans shared non human ancestors. Wilberforce would be turning in his grave assuming, as Williams does, that the soul survives death… cheap canada goose uk

Canada Goose Coats On Sale Rather than arguing, Dawkins and Williams seemed intent on finding areas of agreement. Did the Archbishop agree that there was probably no man that canada goose outlet parka human evolution was gradual, and that in Dawkins formulation no pair of Homo erectus parents gazed down proudly at their Homo sapiens newborn? He did. Pope thinks that, Dawkins claimed. ask him sometime, Williams replied… Canada Goose Coats On Sale

canada goose black friday sale They did, finally, come to verbal blows or gentle nudges, at least over the origins of the universe. the first book of the Bible is the basic information the universe depends on God, humanity has a very distinctive role in that universe, and humanity has made rather a mess of it. am baffled, responded Dawkins, the way sophisticated theologians who know Adam and Eve never existed still keep talking about it. God, he said, up his scientific worldview. canada goose outlet in new york don see clutter coming into it, Williams replied. not thinking of God as an extra who has to be shoehorned into it. more we hear, from a sophisticated archbishop, that the Bible isn a science textbook, but still contains things that God wanted people to know. (Note that Williams admits that the Bible was somehow written under God What, exactly, were those things? Are we tainted by Original Sin or not? What, exactly, is our distinctive role in the universe? And how did we make a mess of it, aside from environmental despoilation? And did god want us to know that it our duty to kill adulterers, or that homosexuality is an abomination? By what warrant does Williams know which parts of the Bible are metaphorical, which are meant literally, which convey those timeless truths of God, and which are to be ignored?It’s hard to resist a feeling of «You can’t win». On the one hand we ‘horsemen’ and ‘new atheists’ are attacked, often aggressively and stridently, for being aggressive and strident. On the other hand, when journalists or religious apologists actually meet us and we turn out to be courteous and civilised, they accuse us of climbing down, «admitting» or «confessing» that we have changed, when actually we are behaving exactly as we always have. They seem to feel let down when they discover that the real people aren anything like the way they so relentlessly portray us; as if, since they gone to the trouble of inventing extravagant caricatures of us, we should at least have the decency to live up to them in real life. canada goose black friday sale

I am actually drawn to the Steve Zara / PZ Myers point that it is hard to think of any evidence that would in principle be capable of convincing me of a god’s existence (a trick, or a hallucination, or insanity, or even a visitation by an evolved super human from outer space would always be more probable). But canada goose outlet toronto factory I didn’t feel like raising this in the Sheldonian, where it would have been so far off the radar of either of my two colleagues as to lead to no fruitful exchange. There was also the risk of a blast of epistemic incomprehensibility from the philosophical referee. And that would have been no way to finish off a civilised evening.

canada goose store Here I disagree with Richard, not about not mentioning this in the Sheldonian (I probably would have done that, though), but about evidence for God. The hypothesis of a supernatural, omnipotent being that can do anything can in principle be supported with evidence. canada goose store

canada goose coats Richard says that one can distinguish that evidence from the actions of an evolved alien or super human, but I willing to provisionally canada goose outlet montreal accept that evidence as pending more data. Suppose canada goose outlet phone number that the Bible had made detailed prophecies that came true, and whose truth wasn brought about by canada goose outlet canada the prophecies themselves? Or if we found secret divine messages coded in our DNA? What if prayers canada goose parka outlet uk always worked, but only prayers uttered by a Jew importuning Yahweh? What if amputees who visited Lourdes regrew their limbs? (Ebon Musings has put together a list of evidences for God that he find convincing.) canada goose coats

canada goose uk shop If a divine, miracle working being appears who has canada goose outlet store montreal characteristics comporting with those of some faith, then I think it okay to provisionally accept that being as We can worry later about whether it an alien or super human (see the take on this at Daylight Atheism). canada goose outlet florida I know some readers will disagree, but remember that this is about evidence that I would accept as a scientist. If other scientists disagree, then we have a controversy. It won be resolved, of course, because such a being almost certainly won appear. canada goose uk shop

Canada Goose Jackets If Richard really accepts the idea of God as a scientific hypothesis, as he seemed to do in The God Delusion, then presumably there evidence that could confirm that hypothesis. If there isn then canada goose outlet it still a hypothesis, but not a scientific one, and one can reject it on first principles canada goose victoria parka outlet without having to deal with like the existence of evil. Canada Goose Jackets

Canada Goose Outlet It is striking how both archbishop and the philosopher in the middle downplay or entirely downgrade the capacity of computation and complexity. The opinion that computers may not even perform correct arithmetic goose outlet canada operations or tell the time is not only factually true for everyone who ever saw an iPhone. Canada Goose Outlet

uk canada goose It is false even metaphorically. They obviously never have been exposed to amazing behavior of neural networks or seemingly magical search evolutionary algorithms, particle simulations or other AI/simulation methods. All of these are based on very simple principles or models and simple beginnings but behave in completely unpredictable (from our perspective or perception) ways when build of great number of components while being at the bottom of it completely deterministic. uk canada goose

I think that lessons of basic cybernetics would do good for both gentlemen.

The profession is split. There are a lot of philosophers who pay lip service or more; there are a lot of philosophers who do know a fair bit, usually one of one science. There canada goose jacket outlet are, unfortunately, canada goose outlet london uk a large number who are essentially scientifically illiterate. I have no idea of relative numbers, and it depends on the part canada goose outlet uk fake of canada goose outlet real the world; it seems (and French philosopher Jacques Bouveresse has agreed) that in France, say, scientific illiteracy is much more common amongst them. (Witness all the, to use one example, Lacanians!)

Canada Goose Online You misunderstood what Anthony Kenny was saying when he said a computer could not add up or tell the time. He was using the Wittgensteinian notion of instrumentality. If you listen to the relevant part of the recording he says computers are tools. Thus he would say we use a computer or calculator of set of tables or abacus or pile of stones or https://www.canadagoosestorevip.com whatever to calculate 3+4 but these things can not themselves calculate 3+4. Incidentally Alan canada goose outlet buffalo Turing, who had been a pupil of Wittgenstein, had very similar views. You might disagree with this view but the iPhone is not a counter example Canada Goose Online

But analogy with abacus is not good here too, because:

Canada Goose sale 1. Computer systems can be autonomous if you design them so. The fact that they are not yet may be result of our current technological limitations and because we do not see need for fully autonomous machines (with free like will). Canada Goose sale

buy canada goose jacket cheap You imply that these tools you mentioned need to have operator. Computers may need them too still but so do human babies. buy canada goose jacket cheap

canada goose coats on sale 2. Complexity of makes some properties to emerge from canada goose outlet online the chaos and multitude of small components. Just like structure of galaxy emerges from simple laws of physics and multitude of stars. cell). canada goose coats on sale

canada goose Abacus or simpler tool do not provide such level of complexity. canada goose

The point Dawkins was making is that the criterion for consciousness we use might be very illusory, that we may even design simple applications which dupe other people in thinking that computer is conscious being. Dealing with primitive algorithm after 5 minutes you may find that canada goose outlet jackets it is machine. For more sophisticated one it might to take you hours. At certain point system may be so complex canada goose jacket outlet uk that humans may never determine if the machine is not conscious or not.

In my opinion Kenny and Williams are use wrong analogies which constrict their thinking. They look at the complex system and see hammer (which is designed to solve specific problem) canada goose outlet authentic that cannot hit the nail by itself. Biological systems are not designed so are not operator canada goose outlet las vegas requiring tools in that sense. Similarly, sufficiently complex computer systems may become more and more self sufficient and autonomous. An maybe one day may reach the threshold when we will be not able to fail them on any Turing test.

canada goose clearance In Machines and Intelligence canada goose outlet in montreal (Mind LIX, no. 2236 (Oct 1950): 433 460), Turing considers the question a machine think? and concludes that it has no canada goose clothing uk clear meaning. He then describes a game called the game in which one person A imitates another B. He then says: canada goose clearance.

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